A tougher poll. We have Vanessa, with her broken supports and Florina-esque stats, or Ephraim, who is constantly reliable in terms of power.
Personally, I go with Vanessa. Unlike Ephraim, Vanessa is amazing on both routs.
Full Version: FE8 Day 12: Vanessa VS. Ephraim
Ephraim Is better. He may class change later but he's got good power and Defense or at least he should. He doesn't have to worry about being shot down by a Bow. Through out most of the game. He's got a specail spear wich does 3x damage to Horses, and Knights. And He's easier to lvl up in the begining. Eventhough most of the begining units have Axes he can still hit them and possibly kill them unlike Vanessa. She probably will die as well unlike Ephraim unless of course you don't use him.
| QUOTE (Swordsalmon @ Aug 17 2007, 05:10 PM) |
| Personally, I go with Vanessa. Unlike Ephraim, Vanessa is amazing on both routs. |
And unlike Vanessa, Ephraim is a Lord. Which means he gets the Supply on his route and he's still required for the Final Chapter on Eirika's.
Eh...frankly, Ephraim is a superior... o_O'
Basically, he's an offensive monster from the beginning to mid-game- he's practically RNG-proof.
Both of these characters are capable of solo-ing the game, but Ephraim can do it easier. (I've actually done this)
Basically, he's an offensive monster from the beginning to mid-game- he's practically RNG-proof.
Both of these characters are capable of solo-ing the game, but Ephraim can do it easier. (I've actually done this)
| QUOTE (Blitzkrieg @ Aug 17 2007, 05:55 PM) |
| Eh...frankly, Ephraim is a superior... o_O' Basically, he's an offensive monster from the beginning to mid-game- he's practically RNG-proof. Both of these characters are capable of solo-ing the game, but Ephraim can do it easier. (I've actually done this) |
Ephraim can easyly solo better then she can. I've done it before two lol. Vannessa almost died unlike him.
I also feel Ephraim is better. He is probably the best GBA lord. I've used him on Eirika's route and he is still a beast. He is good in every stat and he has good supports to make those stats even better. When he class changes his mobility goes up and he gains WT control as well. Ephraim really has hardly any flaws.
Venessa is also one of the best but she relys too much on dodging compared to Ephraim so that is why I say Ephraim is better.
Venessa is also one of the best but she relys too much on dodging compared to Ephraim so that is why I say Ephraim is better.
How the Hell is Vanessa not winning this?
QUOTE ("Erebus")
And unlike Vanessa, Ephraim is a Lord. Which means he gets the Supply on his route and he's still required for the Final Chapter on Eirika's.
Supply is almost useless in chapters and is there primarily to store items you get from chests. I'm not sure how being required for the Final Chapter make Ephraim also superior.
| QUOTE ("TGL") |
Venessa is also one of the best but she relys too much on dodging compared to Ephraim so that is why I say Ephraim is better. |
Yet Vanessa still has sufficient Defense, so she very frail if avoiding doesn't work. Six base with 20% growth isn't too bad, and she gets +5 Defense from supports.
Yea but if your not using people she has supports with she can't get that +5 defense. Also it all depends on who she supports with not everyone gives her +5 defense. Her Average defense stat as a Falco Knight on lvl 20 is 15 wich isn't really that high. And as a Wyvern it's 14 on lvl 20. If she has average stats her highest defense stat will only be 20. Ephraim's defense stats is averaged to be 20 on lvl 20 as a great lord. So even with her Defense plus Ephraim will have just as much Defense of her. Ephraim also has more strength and Skill then she does. She just has more speed and Resistance.
Vanessa.
Ephraim has a shot at taking her down on Ephraim route, where I see them as relatively equal. But Vanessa is definitely superior on Eirika route.
Vanessa has the best durability in the game, unparalleled early-game usefulness and good offense. Even on Ephraim route, she's beating Ephraim pretty soundly until late-game because of her supports.
Ephraim has a shot at taking her down on Ephraim route, where I see them as relatively equal. But Vanessa is definitely superior on Eirika route.
Vanessa has the best durability in the game, unparalleled early-game usefulness and good offense. Even on Ephraim route, she's beating Ephraim pretty soundly until late-game because of her supports.
How in the world does Vanessa have the best Durability in the game if her defense growth is 20% and her HP growth is only 50% wich is one of the lowest HP growths out of every unit in the game. The Best thing she's got is her resistance and her speed is all.
She has good DEF and is practically unhittable. That's how she has the best durability in the game.
She approaches the realm of 100 AVO at level 20/10. She would be completely unhittable if she could take advantage of terrain. About the only things that ever hit her are the weak, fast enemies, and they don't do a lot of damage because she has good DEF.
At any rate, she almost never gets hit. And anything with any sort of hit rate against her won't do much damage to her.
Yeah, she's got the best durability in the game by far.
She approaches the realm of 100 AVO at level 20/10. She would be completely unhittable if she could take advantage of terrain. About the only things that ever hit her are the weak, fast enemies, and they don't do a lot of damage because she has good DEF.
At any rate, she almost never gets hit. And anything with any sort of hit rate against her won't do much damage to her.
Yeah, she's got the best durability in the game by far.
Having good avo doesn't mean you have good Durability. Ephraim dodges too. And His Con is higher then Vanessa's so his weapon doesn't slow him down. Agianst Ephraim the cpus have low enough hit anyway. Thats also just releying on Dodging which is really bad. Once your hit your practiclly done especally if she gets hit by an arrow. Enemys with hit's like 10 can possibly hit. and if a Sniper comes up on her and Sure Shots her she's Dead. She doesn't get the Fili Sheild till much later into the game.
Um... yes, that's exactly what it means. Vanessa has enough AVO so that she pretty much never gets hit. Regular enemies have low hit rates against her even with her at a WTD. Which means she literally has no chance to be hit against most enemies wielding weapons, since she'll usually have WTA.
The only enemies with consistent hit rates against her are Valkyries, Mauthe Doogs, you know, all of those enemies who can't damage her anyway.
And if you're arguing that enemies have low enough hit that Ephraim dodges often enough, then Vanessa is really never getting hit.
Relying on dodging is great when you can dodge everything. And you seem to be missing the fact that Ephraim's DEF isn't much better than Vanessa's (actually, Vanessa is winning here until late-game), so even when Vanessa gets hit, she takes very little more damage than Ephraim, who is going to be getting hit far more often than she is. Ephraim has the HP cushion though, granted.
Good thing there are a total of like two Snipers in this entire game, eh? C'mon. You're telling me that a Sniper with Sure Shot makes any difference?
The only enemies with consistent hit rates against her are Valkyries, Mauthe Doogs, you know, all of those enemies who can't damage her anyway.
And if you're arguing that enemies have low enough hit that Ephraim dodges often enough, then Vanessa is really never getting hit.
Relying on dodging is great when you can dodge everything. And you seem to be missing the fact that Ephraim's DEF isn't much better than Vanessa's (actually, Vanessa is winning here until late-game), so even when Vanessa gets hit, she takes very little more damage than Ephraim, who is going to be getting hit far more often than she is. Ephraim has the HP cushion though, granted.
Good thing there are a total of like two Snipers in this entire game, eh? C'mon. You're telling me that a Sniper with Sure Shot makes any difference?
I'm breaking the tie and saying Vanessa. The reason being. . . I started to actually train her, without ToV, half-way through a hard mode playthrough and she still was able to kill and lvl quickly. In two chapters she was a Wyvern Knight. And DAMN. She maxed nearly every stat. All she was missing was 2 Luck. In the final Chapter, she killed lyon with a Silver Lance Peirce Critical. . . .
Yea but not Everyone Vanessa is like that. My Vanessa wasn't even close to caping in anything but speed. I used both of them and Ephriam was Behond better but thats personal experence. So i checked there stat growths and average stats and Ephriam is completly better in everything but Resitance and Speed. But Ephiram has more con so that basicly cancils out her Speed advantage. And With Ephriams supports he gets attack and a Crit boost.
And that's why personal experience doesn't mean anything.
If you take everything into account, Vanessa is clearly superior on Eirika's route. It's totally inarguable. Ephraim probably won't even be able to catch up to her by the end of the game.
On Ephraim route, it's a lot more arguable. Ephraim might be a winner here. Vanessa is the clear victor in the mid game, due to her level advantage and supports. But by late-game, Ephraim should have everything built up, and he's probably doing better than her.
If you take everything into account, Vanessa is clearly superior on Eirika's route. It's totally inarguable. Ephraim probably won't even be able to catch up to her by the end of the game.
On Ephraim route, it's a lot more arguable. Ephraim might be a winner here. Vanessa is the clear victor in the mid game, due to her level advantage and supports. But by late-game, Ephraim should have everything built up, and he's probably doing better than her.